Immunity Challenge #2

[It's Colton Cumbie, Friends!]

Uh well, sheesh. Figures that the second I get into the game, I'm immediately forced to defend white people's ability to say the N-word.

I don't know what backgrounds a lot of y'all are coming from, but personally, I'm a senior in university and I've written more persuasive essays than I can count, plus I'm a former debate champion, and I've taken courses in argumentative logic.

So, I could theoretically do well for us, at least in the post-debate argument section. But we need to have everybody contribute, so I dunno, should we all discuss what reasons there might be for allowing white people to use the N-word?

[Ethan Zohn]

I can start doing some research now on it but off the top of my head, I can say our argument might be that non-blacks be allowed to use it as long as we don't use it in an offensive manner and doesn't imply hostility?

[Kelly Bruno]

I really wanna just abstain from this challenge, but I'd say that Ethan's idea is likely along the best route if we have to defend non-black use of the word. We might also want to differentiate between the use of nigger and nigga (because there is a difference).

[Rob Cesternino]

NIGGER- a black man with a slavery chain around his neck.

NIGGA- a black man with a gold chain on his neck.

[Rob Cesternino]

Whatever they say.. can we come back with "Oh yeah?... We''ll fuck you."

[Kelly Bruno]

Jan 18, 2013 20:56:27 GMT -5 Rob Cesternino said:

Whatever they say.. can we come back with "Oh yeah?... We''ll fuck you."

Not if we want to win.

[Rob Cesternino]

does this make any sense

When they say it.. they think its fine and cool, but if we say it then all of a sudden they get offensive about it? That's really kind of treating us like shit and saying we're not their friends. Which in return pulls out the race card, saying since we're not black we can't joke around with them calling each other ______

[Kelly Bruno]

Jan 18, 2013 22:32:36 GMT -5 Rob Cesternino said:

does this make any sense

When they say it.. they think its fine and cool, but if we say it then all of a sudden they get offensive about it? That's really kind of treating us like shit and saying we're not their friends. Which in return pulls out the race card, saying since we're not black we can't joke around with them calling each other ______

It makes sense as an interpretation of what happens, but it's not very good for arguing that white people should be allowed to use it. It's just kind of whiny.

The white people saying it in your example commit a major social transgression towards the black people by using it. Being friends with those black people who say it to each other doesn't mean the white people allowed to say it with them. The white people are not a part of the group.

That's like just scratching the surface of the issue though. The negative reaction to white people using it is due to historical and on-going oppression of black people by white people.

[Colby Donaldson]

I kinda think it depends on where you live. I live in Tennessee and it's common to hear nigger or colored in everyday lingo but when I lived in California, Nobody said it. It's just a description here like saying someone is blonde or tall and not as a slur against black people.

My best friend is from South Africa and she is what they call 'colored' but here people say she is 'black' and it's offensive to her because black is a slur there and the preferred term is 'colored' so I really just think it's where your heart lies with it and if you have malice in behind the things you say.

[Kelly Bruno]

Yeah, the social atmosphere around can influence it.

[RC Saint-Amour]

I do think Rob has a point by saying that there is a bit of a double standard when blacks use the term "nigga" to refer to each other in a playful manner, but when a white person says it, it's automatically racist. We just need to find some way to phrase it so it doesn't come across as whiny, because one of the things I've learned back when I was taking debate and communication theory in my senior year of high school was that if you dress words up so that they're presented in a flattering manner, the audience will be more inclined to listen to you. And I also agree with Colby that race is a cultural thing more than a biological thing. In my education class during my freshman year of college, we were discussing how it was considered less offensive to say African American instead of black, and one of the black girls in my class said that she'd rather be called black, because she identifies with that label more than she does with African American.

[Ethan Zohn]

Well so far I managed to find two articles relating to this. Hope it helps:

ideas.time.com/2011/10/12/can-whites-say-the-n-word/

www.theinsanityreport.com/home/index.php/2010/08/13/random-thoughts/white-people-can-use-the-n-word/

[It's Colton Cumbie, Friends!]

I think another point we could potentially make is that in a sense, having a word like that, where only black people are allowed to use it, continues to foster a very "us versus them" mentality. If the end goal is for people to view black and white as equals, or at least equals with certain superficial differences, then there should be that openness between the two groups.

[Malcolm Freberg]

I have heard that black people, (especially young people) try to justify using it by saying,"we're taking back the word, to remove the power."

That word was used as a derogatory comment for so long, I honestly don't understand why they would want to call themselves that at all, but that's just me.

This challenge is a little uncomfortable actually.. lol


I think it's the same with other phrases too. Like "Dyke". It's ok for lesbians to use that term, but if someone straight uses it, it's translated as an insult.

[Kelly Bruno]

Jan 19, 2013 1:58:09 GMT -5 Malcolm Freberg said:

I think it's the same with other phrases too. Like "Dyke". It's ok for lesbians to use that term, but if someone straight uses it, it's translated as an insult.

Yeah, it's that same sort of thing.